r7000 vs r 7000p performance?

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Duxa
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Joined: 16 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2022 20:06    Post subject: r7000 vs r 7000p performance? Reply with quote
Well, longs story short, bought r7000p on ebay, when it arrived its actually r7000

From quick googling the 'p' variant is about 3 years newer and supports MU-MIMO. I cant get much more info on the differences between these 2.

I am now not sure if I should request a return, or just keep the r7000. Question for you guys. Would r7000p offer me anything better except for MU-MIMO support over r7000?

Benefit of r7000 is that it seems to have better support from custom fw community (ddwrt, tomato, openwrt support), vs just ddwrt for r7000p.
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dale_gribble39
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2022 21:34    Post subject: Reply with quote
https://wikidevi.wi-cat.ru/Netgear_R7000P
https://wikidevi.wi-cat.ru/Netgear_R7000
MU-MIMO is marketing nonsense

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Duxa
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2022 21:50    Post subject: Reply with quote
dale_gribble39 wrote:
https://wikidevi.wi-cat.ru/Netgear_R7000P
https://wikidevi.wi-cat.ru/Netgear_R7000
MU-MIMO is marketing nonsense


Ive read those. They seem to be pretty much identical. Id like to hear stories of people that actually used one or the other.
Alozaros
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2022 21:51    Post subject: Reply with quote
keep the R7000 its a great unit for a mid class router..
the P was also linked to some different radio layout and was not that ideal...if im not wrong..surely there was some nasty stuff..but don't clearly remember... Rolling Eyes
My R7000 hasn't been bad at all it does work as it should...just not that capable like R7800 but for mid class stuff its fine...

on R7000 there is no lights off switch, so to turn them off only via script...
add this to start up commands

for i in 2 3 8 9 12 13 17 18 ; do gpio enable $i ; done
for i in 14 15 ; do gpio disable $i ; done

_________________
Atheros
TP-Link WR740Nv1 ---DD-WRT 55179 WAP
TP-Link WR1043NDv2 -DD-WRT 55303 Gateway/DoT,Forced DNS,Ad-Block,Firewall,x4VLAN,VPN
TP-Link WR1043NDv2 -Gargoyle OS 1.15.x AP,DNS,QoS,Quotas
Qualcomm-Atheros
Netgear XR500 --DD-WRT 55460 Gateway/DoH,Forced DNS,AP Isolation,4VLAN,Ad-Block,Firewall,Vanilla
Netgear R7800 --DD-WRT 55460 Gateway/DoT,AD-Block,Forced DNS,AP&Net Isolation,x3VLAN,Firewall,Vanilla
Netgear R9000 --DD-WRT 55363 Gateway/DoT,AD-Block,AP Isolation,Firewall,Forced DNS,x2VLAN,Vanilla
Broadcom
Netgear R7000 --DD-WRT 55460 Gateway/SmartDNS/DoH,AD-Block,Firewall,Forced DNS,x3VLAN,VPN
NOT USING 5Ghz ANYWHERE
------------------------------------------------------
Stubby DNS over TLS I DNSCrypt v2 by mac913
Duxa
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Joined: 16 Aug 2013
Posts: 191

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2022 21:55    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alozaros wrote:
keep the R7000 its a great unit for a mid class router..
the P was also linked to some different radio layout and was not that ideal...if im not wrong..surely there was some nasty stuff..but don't clearly remember... Rolling Eyes
My R7000 hasn't been bad at all it does work as it should...just not that capable like R7800 but for mid class stuff its fine...

on R7000 there is no lights off switch, so to turn them off only via script...
add this to start up commands

for i in 2 3 8 9 12 13 17 18 ; do gpio enable $i ; done
for i in 14 15 ; do gpio disable $i ; done


When you talk about capabilities vs R7800, can you elaborate? Are you talking about speeds? Wired? Wifi? Or something else?
Alozaros
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2022 22:03    Post subject: Reply with quote
yep speeds and overall performance...both are not very comparable...as the hardware is way different...in my case ages ago R7000 was an edge router with lot of heavy use...now R7800 is...overall R7800 wins in VPN, WAN speed, QoS, Radio performance(range and compatibility), not that i had any issues with R7000 radio when it was seen heavy use...

R7800 is a high class dual core 2x1.7Ghz Qualcomm where
R7000 is a mid class with dual core 2x1Ghz Broadcom

both CPU's are very different on performance side...WAN, VPN, QoS and ect... as well R7000 has Broadcom radios with proprietary drivers...

_________________
Atheros
TP-Link WR740Nv1 ---DD-WRT 55179 WAP
TP-Link WR1043NDv2 -DD-WRT 55303 Gateway/DoT,Forced DNS,Ad-Block,Firewall,x4VLAN,VPN
TP-Link WR1043NDv2 -Gargoyle OS 1.15.x AP,DNS,QoS,Quotas
Qualcomm-Atheros
Netgear XR500 --DD-WRT 55460 Gateway/DoH,Forced DNS,AP Isolation,4VLAN,Ad-Block,Firewall,Vanilla
Netgear R7800 --DD-WRT 55460 Gateway/DoT,AD-Block,Forced DNS,AP&Net Isolation,x3VLAN,Firewall,Vanilla
Netgear R9000 --DD-WRT 55363 Gateway/DoT,AD-Block,AP Isolation,Firewall,Forced DNS,x2VLAN,Vanilla
Broadcom
Netgear R7000 --DD-WRT 55460 Gateway/SmartDNS/DoH,AD-Block,Firewall,Forced DNS,x3VLAN,VPN
NOT USING 5Ghz ANYWHERE
------------------------------------------------------
Stubby DNS over TLS I DNSCrypt v2 by mac913
Duxa
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Joined: 16 Aug 2013
Posts: 191

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2022 22:30    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alozaros wrote:
yep speeds and overall performance...both are not very comparable...as the hardware is way different...in my case ages ago R7000 was an edge router with lot of heavy use...now R7800 is...overall R7800 wins in VPN, WAN speed, QoS, Radio performance(range and compatibility), not that i had any issues with R7000 radio when it was seen heavy use...

R7800 is a high class dual core 2x1.7Ghz Qualcomm where
R7000 is a mid class with dual core 2x1Ghz Broadcom

both CPU's are very different on performance side...WAN, VPN, QoS and ect... as well R7000 has Broadcom radios with proprietary drivers...


Got any examples of even percentages of comparison (i have no frame of reference so hard to know what id be missing out on)

im surprised that you can saturate dual core 1Ghz processor even at gig speeds.
dale_gribble39
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2022 23:18    Post subject: Reply with quote
Duxa wrote:
Ive read those. They seem to be pretty much identical. Id like to hear stories of people that actually used one or the other.

Either my eyes deceive me here, or you make assumptions. The CPUs are not identical and one of the wireless radios is a different chipset.

R7000P
CPU1: Broadcom BCM4708C0 (1 GHz, 2 cores)
WI1 chip1: Broadcom BCM4365E
WI2 chip1: Broadcom BCM4360

R7000
CPU1: Broadcom BCM4709A0 (1 GHz, 2 cores)
WI1 chip1: Broadcom BCM4360
WI2 chip1: Broadcom BCM4360

https://www.google.com/search?q=R7000+site%3Aforum.dd-wrt.com

https://www.google.com/search?q=R7000P+site%3Aforum.dd-wrt.com

https://www.google.com/search?q=R7800+site%3Aforum.dd-wrt.com

https://www.google.com/search?q=R7000+performance

https://www.google.com/search?q=R7000P+performance

https://www.google.com/search?q=R7800+performance

I'll let others decide if your requests are reasonable or not.

_________________
"The woods are lovely, dark and deep,
But I have promises to keep,
And miles to go before I sleep,
And miles to go before I sleep." - Robert Frost

"I am one of the noticeable ones - notice me" - Dale Frances McKenzie Bozzio

<fact>code knows no gender</fact>

This is me, knowing I've ruffled your feathers, and not giving a ****
Some people are still hard-headed.

--------------------------------------
Mac Pro (Mid 2012) - Two 2.4GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon E5645 processors 64GB 1333MHz DDR3 ECC SDRAM OpenSUSE Leap 15.5
Duxa
DD-WRT User


Joined: 16 Aug 2013
Posts: 191

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2022 23:40    Post subject: Reply with quote
dale_gribble39 wrote:
Duxa wrote:
Ive read those. They seem to be pretty much identical. Id like to hear stories of people that actually used one or the other.

Either my eyes deceive me here, or you make assumptions. The CPUs are not identical and one of the wireless radios is a different chipset.

R7000P
CPU1: Broadcom BCM4708C0 (1 GHz, 2 cores)
WI1 chip1: Broadcom BCM4365E
WI2 chip1: Broadcom BCM4360

R7000
CPU1: Broadcom BCM4709A0 (1 GHz, 2 cores)
WI1 chip1: Broadcom BCM4360
WI2 chip1: Broadcom BCM4360


I guess we have different definitions of "pretty much the same". Id consider CPU from the same family running at the same clock speed to be 'pretty much the same'

Quote:
Advanced ARM® Cortex™-A9 Dual-Core
32 KB I-cache and 32 KB D-cache per core
Snoop Control Unit (SCU) with ACP interface for I/O coherency
256 KB L2 Cache (shared)
SMP and AMP capable
Single-processor core operation configurable
Advanced Gigabit Ethernet
Eight ports with full-line rate
Five 10/100/1000 PHY ports
Support for lot 6 power standard
Hardware Flow Accelerator
RGMII/MII-lite interface


5Ghz chip is different indeed, but is it different beyond adding MU-MIMO support?
the-joker
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2022 6:50    Post subject: Reply with quote
The only difference between the 5Ghz radios is the R7000P supports 1024-QAM and 4x4:4 while the R7000 only supports 256-QAM and 3x3:3 which is the number of bandwidth streams able to send/receive data concurrently.

And just because the routers support 3x3:3 or 4x4:4, most your consumer devices like mobiles etc likely will not and rare are the ones which support any QAM of any generation at all, so it wont be faster for all clients.

https://www.broadcom.com/products/broadband/xdsl/bcm4366e says its a 4x4 with 2.2 Gb/s PHY Rate pretty decent

https://www.broadcom.com/products/wireless/wireless-lan-infrastructure/bcm4360 1.3 Gb/s PHY rate

I also had a look at https://wikidevi.wi-cat.ru/Broadcom and that page's information doesnt tally with the product pages on Broadcom's site.

Sure, the P revision looks like a better alternative with a better performace 5 GHz radio, if you will actually see any better performance is debatable, just better coverage apparently which will depend greatly on the environmental conditions.

In the end, Broadcom and closed source drivers but its good bang for your buck.

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ho1Aetoo
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2022 7:37    Post subject: Reply with quote
This is only a 3x3 router, it also has only 3x3 radios and only 3 antenna connections.

https://www.smallnetbuilder.com/images/stories/wireless/netgear_r7000p/netgear_r7000p_board_radio_side.jpg
the-joker
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2022 8:31    Post subject: Reply with quote
So wiki.dev is right, even though the Broadcom specs for the chip allow 4x4:4

Which then really means by design the benefits of the new radio mean sod all and so the mu-mimo is just a gimmick as per neutered implementation. That is if I understood it right.

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itwontbewe
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2022 16:23    Post subject: Reply with quote
The R7000P has limited 5 GHz. The lower channels are missing and I haven't been able to setup a VAP on 5 GHz.

* both of these have been fixed. thanks bs for your amazing work


Last edited by itwontbewe on Wed Jun 29, 2022 11:01; edited 1 time in total
egc
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2022 18:38    Post subject: Reply with quote
Moved to broadcom
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2022 8:19    Post subject: Reply with quote
Anyone interested in R7000P 5Ghz VAP issue can follow https://forum.dd-wrt.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=1265905#1265905
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